Species sanitisation

Why has today’s angler become so obsessed with species 'sanitisation'?

I’m being deliberately provocative here and use a term which I deem, in this context, to be a derogatory term but I'm being no less sincere and that’s coming from someone who is extremely OCD about his gear but what about the waters that we fish?

I was talking to the new owners of a recently acquired fishery with several lakes and in stark contrast to my initial conversations, where the underlying tone was to promote the lakes very much as they were, namely mixed and balanced fisheries, the new approach seems to be one of ‘we’ll put the Carp in this lake, the silvers can go in that one and the Pike are all being transferred over there’.

This is, apparently, the result of feedback from anglers who have visited the fishery since its takeover and I can hardly blame the owners for doing the due diligence and striving to provide what’s been asked for.

So…

Tracking back to the source, why do what appears to be so many of today’s anglers want their fisheries sanitised and put into neat little classifications as opposed to mixed, balanced fisheries which retain a natural feel to them?

Personally I hate the idea and I for one won’t be buying another year book if the whole thing goes ahead but that still leaves me wondering why so many seem to want the underlying circumstances stacked so heavily in their favour, instead of working with the circumstances and finding a successful approach to their fishing and one which develops wider skills outside of their intended sphere.

I’m completely baffled by it…

Can't answer your question as I'm much the same. I like catching anything and not knowing what's coming out next is part of the fun. It's just as enjoyable to try to winkle out something specific when there other species there. Although I could do without Pike. Magnificent fish but not when they're trying to eat your catch or ruining your swim. On the other hand they're part of the ecology and as long as they're not too prolific it won't stop me fishing anywhere.

There is absolutely no sense in it whatsoever, the fishery seems from what I see on their facebook page to be doing well, the predator potential is untapped, that imo wont be the case if some big girls show up in the proposed move, all and sundry will be after them with the usual results.

from what I have seen and from what you told me on the phone the fishery is at the moment balanced with the added bonus of just not knowing what the next bite will bring, something of a rarity nowadays.

To ruin a balanced fishery for that's what I think this will do because some anglers? want to be able to catch small carp all day is just wrong.

Why some want this type of fishery I have no idea, perhaps they don't feel the need to keep learning and improving, it could be that now even the older generation have joined the "want it now" crew that older people criticise the younger generation for.

To me its all about some wanting the easy way out but what happens when they get bored with the repetitiveness of it? do they move elsewhere leaving a water ruined by their selfishness? others such as yourself not fishing there because its so predictable and eventually the owners realising they made a huge expensive mistake that they haven't the money to put right.

There are imo to many self appointed fishery experts that have no qualifications, any wholesale changes to a fishery should be under the guidance of people qualified in that field and I wouldn't be at all surprised if they did they would be telling the owners to leave things as they are.

Its not just fisheries imo that are sanitised but anglers do it to themselves, by that I mean those that refuse to fish for other species thinking that what they fish for somehow makes them better than other anglers, I have witnessed this on a couple of the carp water syndicates I have belonged to that held big Tench and Bream that some refused to fish for, each to their own I suppose but its not for me.

Well, the "match anglers" all seem to like the Carp don't they?

There's a commercial near me that has a "specimen" lake (the largest carp is mid 20's, Roach to 2lb, Bream to 5lb - I wouldn't call those specimens). It has two other lakes, one has a lot of F1's, small carp, general silvers. This is the "match" lake. Not sure what's in the 3rd, but it's similar to the 2nd I think.

Now, I can understand having all the larger Carp in one lake, getting all the Carp guys & night fishing on one lake. I can't see the point of ruining the rest of it though.

I'm not really sure where you might be going with this. It's common enough, even amongst those that suggest that they want mixed fisheries. Plenty of folks moan about individual species, an over-abundance of tiddlers, too many big fish lurking amongst the smaller species, etc, etc.

We've got to an end game where some carp waters want nothing but carp, removing other species completely if they can. Plenty of more general anglers hate the prospect of having pike in stillwaters. Match types tend to not want anything too big. For others, it might be carp, bream, eels etc, etc. Fisheries, especially those that need to make money, have to try to do whatever it takes to make the most money.

All we can do as individuals is find waters which are as close a fit to our ideal as possible, and fish them. Make hay while the sun shines too, because your perfect fishery is unlikely to remain perfect indefinitely.

We have always messed about with nature and increased the odds in our favour so too speak. Stocking fish is not a new thing. I remember catching little stockie barble in the early 80's on the flood wall River trent at wilford. It used to be 'one a bung' on a bit of meat and a bomb I did not even feed its was that easy! I used to hook them and let my lad wind them in!

What I'm saying is the modern ideas of carp only lakes, Tench lakes etc. They are just a progression on. The pike lakes are the most worrying though, a club I'm in chuck all the pike in one lake, obviously they all turn carnivorous due to a lack of food it's strange way about things.

daniel121 said:

Stocking fish is not a new thing.

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The fishery in the OPs initial post isn't stocking anything, more moving what they have.

It is a sure sh*t shame. I love the commies that keep it natural as possible! Overstocking and sanitizing really grinds my gears!!!!!!!

Personally, I wouldn't go near any 'fishery' where fish are 'moved about' or otherwise. Likewise I drive past places showing a XYZ Fishery @ 10 quid a day, or whatever. They would not be where I want to do my fishing.
Not to say they don't fulfil the requirement of some anglers because they obviously do, but they are not for me....

I can appreciate some folk only have time for 'instant success' type fishing, if I can call it that, and matchmen who want to catch huge bags when fishing still waters is also fine. It's just I choose to fish in a different way.....

I am pleased to say I still have access to waters that have remained the same for as long as I can remember and all are what might be termed 'mixed fisheries'. They are pretty much left to their own devices with only trees or excessive pads thinned out every 3/4 years or so, if ever. Yes, I am plagued by unwanted species on many occasions but for me, working out how to avoid them is all part of fishing.....

I suppose it could be said I am far too fussy around where I fish and I know for a fact I could land bigger specimens if I chose to fish 'prepared' waters, but I, like some others above, see 'the not knowing' element as all part of the enjoyment usually found with mixed fisheries. In the past I have reluctantly stopped fishing waters (containing huge carp) when passing anglers start to ask if I've caught 'Daisy' or 'Blueback' and the like, and swims become scarce.

Just as well we don't all see things in the same way.........................

It's a human trait and not a nice one to want segregation, lack of diversity and a mono culture. A venue owner always asks if I have caught any carp yet and when I reply thankfully not he expresses surprise! I love a mixed Fishery no matter how difficult it is to fish and the fact that sometimes you do and sometimes you don't!

As with so much in the world today its about convenience. People want it on a plate.

The other thing is "sanitization" rarely will get to or stay at 100%. Sanitized fisheries can become havens for some great niche fishing..for example the "match" lake could be worth a look by the Perch specialist in a few years. The "Carp" lake could hide some huge Roach, Tench or Bream and the "mixed" lake could hide a jumbo Carp they missed in the original netting and now has the place to grow big in all by himself.

There are opportunities everywhere if anglers are willing to look for them.

It is not only commercial fisheries that do this,. One of the clubs I am a member of has a pool devoted to catfish and carp. The catfish go to 44lb and the carp to around 25lb, There are I think 25 carp and 17 cats in it. This may sound good for most speci anglers, I have not fished it and have no intention of doing so,but I bailiff it. The pool has a central island down the centre similar to a snake lake on a commercial. I could cast a waggler across the pool and a feeder lengthways, If you hit into a large catfish you have to hope it does not head for the island 20 yards from the bank. It does have it devotees but as one big fish angler has said " It is not a pool for large cats or carp, it is a pond" Another likened it to a "large goldfish bowl" Both anglers will not fish it. The club has waters which are much larger that would be more suitable and more demanding on trying to catch, these pools have cats to 70lb and large carp to 35lb+. The club have relocated some smaller cats up to 10lb from a water and put them in one of these larger waters, there is talk if things are ok after a while with the relocation the larger ones will be removed from the pond" At the moment it seems to be a supply and demand culture, Some members demand more specimen waters and the club are supplying them, to the detriment of members who like mixed fisheries. There are a few members of the club I am in on here so they will know which waters I am on about.

Most day ticket and syndicate waters these days advertise what they contain. X, Y Z amount of 20,30,40lb or bigger carp. It’s what gets the punters through the door.
I have no interest in these types of waters. I am still stuck in the past where the mystery of angling was the unknown. Which why apart from when Pike fishing I have very few if any targeted species days.
Another thing creating predator waters never works predators need a balanced mixed fishery to survive.

As much as I want to have a go for a Catfish, I just can't see the point of putting them into a club water. They are very carnivorous and will take other fish to a fair size, just look at what they can get in their mouths.

On a commercial water I can see the attraction. One local to me has a Cat & Carp lake, a separate Carp lake, and 2 other mixed lakes, one with big stocking of F1's.

If I really want a mixed bag, I'll go down to the local river, never know what you're going to catch on the Colne, it's a lovely place to fish. I had 7 species in a couple of hours a few weeks ago, great fun.

The "manufactured " concept isn't one that rocks my boat, it's all a little alien to what I consider Angling to be about so in the main I steer clear of waters that I know to be overstocked and overcrowded but, there are , as mentioned previously the odd commercial that have the occasional hidden gem of an angling opportunity that I sometimes use on the offchance I may catch a fish or two that may not be present in waters elsewhere .
I love my roach and an easy carp runs water in Lincolnshire has some stunners that are avoided by many of its users that suits me just fine as a mussel fished in the margins is a sure fire way of catching a few big roach that must be tired of feeding on tiny trails of half digested carp poo.
Another nearer home has a splendid head of largely neglected roach in preference to its huge stocks of easy carp Next month it will be feutured in the monthly " pole fishing" mag which will show a pik of an angler with a superb net of pole caught roach, not often If ever I've looked at that mag but I may do so next time it hits the shelves.
Each to their own I suppose, not for me, but ignoring these waters could be a disadvantage as there are one or two hidden gems out there.

Another thing I don't like is a sanitised fishery where swims are all the same, where fishing can only be carried out from ready-made swims. All snags, reeds etc have been removed. Many club waters are now like this.
I even have this now some club river sections where rules state no new swims to be created. I have always ignored this one.

I can’t say why anglers want to be on waters fabricated into Match Pools, Silver Fish Pools, Beastie (sic) Lakes, Beginner’s Ponds etc etc.

Of course; convenience, onsite facilities, high stock levels and all the rest.

But whether fishing organised in this way dismays or delights a person seem to depend on the angler’s sense of what fishing is all about. Or even, what life is all about.

Needing a new pair of shoes, with time on my hands, I drove up to a retail park just off the M1. (Not far, as it happens, from the OP’s neck of the woods.)

I found ample onsite parking, 65 “leading brands”, and a chance to eat in a “foodcourt” tempting me with Burger King, Chopstix, Costa, Krispy Kreme (wtf?), Pizza Express, Spud-U-Like, Starbucks, Subway, Wagamama, Yogi Bar, Harry Ramsdens and Yorkshire Puddies.

It felt like a cheesy Sci-Fi scenario – a future where stunned consumers safely exercise their choice and free-will in an official Leisure Zone.

I admit Lakeview, Cudmore etc are not that bad. But they’re working on it.

The convenience of commies is useful. I don't like fishing where I'm too far from a loo, unfortunately my health dictates that necessity. If I'm going to be there all day, it would be nice to get a decent cup of coffee. One of my local commies ticks both these boxes well. In fact, I can bring my lines in and feel safe that nobody is going to nick my gear, unlike the unfortunate incident at Farlows last week.

Its all a question of balance....both in particular lakes and fisheries overall. I dont like any water where one species dominates almost to the exclusion of all others which is why I rarely fish commercials....and when I do I rarely target the carp. I'm afraid commercial fisheries are just that and if the ticket buying anglers want carp only, cat only or pike only lakes then that's what the owners will give them...or at least would be foolish to ignore.

I'm more concerned about the management of club waters where well intentioned but ill informed stockings have the potential to ruin a water.

markcw said:

It is not only commercial fisheries that do this,. One of the clubs I am a member of has a pool devoted to catfish and carp. The catfish go to 44lb and the carp to around 25lb, There are I think 25 carp and 17 cats in it. This may sound good for most speci anglers, I have not fished it and have no intention of doing so,but I bailiff it. The pool has a central island down the centre similar to a snake lake on a commercial. I could cast a waggler across the pool and a feeder lengthways, If you hit into a large catfish you have to hope it does not head for the island 20 yards from the bank. It does have it devotees but as one big fish angler has said " It is not a pool for large cats or carp, it is a pond" Another likened it to a "large goldfish bowl" Both anglers will not fish it. The club has waters which are much larger that would be more suitable and more demanding on trying to catch, these pools have cats to 70lb and large carp to 35lb+. The club have relocated some smaller cats up to 10lb from a water and put them in one of these larger waters, there is talk if things are ok after a while with the relocation the larger ones will be removed from the pond" At the moment it seems to be a supply and demand culture, Some members demand more specimen waters and the club are supplying them, to the detriment of members who like mixed fisheries. There are a few members of the club I am in on here so they will know which waters I am on about.

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I'm surprised the ea are allowing the club to keep moving catfish round as and when they please!