Why do we still whip rod rings on ?

I was thinking about this the other day, It seems very old fashioned.

How about some sort of rubberized band aid / wrap to attach them ? On one old telescopic rod I have the rings slot into a plastic coller on the rod and can be removed when in transit.

Surely there must be a better way ?

Hmmmm, I like to think traditional rather than old fashioned.

Given the criticality of the ring function, especially when you are attached to the fish of a lifetime, I would be more comfortable knowing that they are unlikely to ping off due to some perished rubber or a Heath Robinson cheapo method of attaching.

I cannot see another reliable way. There may be a way of using shrink tube in manufacture if starting at the butt and working up getting smaller and smaller. However what about renewing a rod ring that has broke half way up a rod blank.

As to the rings on a tele , they are only glued on the top of each section. If this were to be applied to a conventional rod it would severely limit the proper ring spacing.

I don't think the traditional way using whipping is very difficult.

I learned in the last few years than not all manufacturers do still whip eyes, though it wasn't obvious. I found out because I managed to mangle a single eye on a Shimano rod. I bought an exact replacement ring and a friend replaced it for me. He handed back the mangled ring and the remnants of the "whipping" because he'd been puzzled by it. To all intents and purposes it appeared to be carbon tape. It was then varnished over in the usual manner. You wouldn't know it wasn't traditional whipping until you took a scalpel to it.

sam vimes said:

I learned in the last few years than not all manufacturers do still whip eyes, though it wasn't obvious. I found out because I managed to mangle a single eye on a Shimano rod. I bought an exact replacement ring and a friend replaced it for me. He handed back the mangled ring and the remnants of the "whipping" because he'd been puzzled by it. To all intents and purposes it appeared to be carbon tape. It was then varnished over in the usual manner. You wouldn't know it wasn't traditional whipping until you took a scalpel to it.

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Well thats a revalation. You learn something every day. So...............dinosaurs can learn.mg:

Carbon tape has been used for a little while now. Even guide frames are made with carbon (why I don't know as the difference in weight of some frames - size for size - can only be miniscule. In the past the biggest weight saving was by using single legged guides and avoiding one lot of thread and epoxy covering - not the leg of the guide).

Many a year ago, I used Zziplex and Conoflex rods for my beach fishing. I never had the rings whipped on. All were held on with Black electrical tape, only the tip ring was glued on. Never had a ring move or damage.

iain t said:

Many a year ago, I used Zziplex and Conoflex rods for my beach fishing. I never had the rings whipped on. All were held on with Black electrical tape, only the tip ring was glued on. Never had a ring move or damage.

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I used to devote my close season to fly fishing, during some of those periods at Toft Newton there was a guy who's rod was very similar-- all the rings held on with insulating tape.
He never seemed to have any problems and had more than his share of Trout!.

Other than when a ring needs replacing (how often is that? ) shrink tube would do the job, being unable to whip anything these days when I made the sarkanda wagglers I now use I used shrink tube top and bottom of them, so far I have had no problems with it.

It works, it is strong, by the way, many turns of a fine thread are stronger than fewer turns of a thicker thread. Not that there's much in our waters to test a rod to that extent. It looks good when finished, multiple colour choices and tags if so desired, easy to adjust and line up rings. Quick to do, excluding the ring location and epoxy work - which would probably be done anyway - a pro (factory) builder with a turner should do it in 2 minutes easy.
I think it is here to stay.

It does not surprise me to hear some rod manufacturers are already using alternatives to whippings.

I find it hard to accept that in todays world the best way to attach something to a round pole is to still basically tie it on with thread !

There must be a better way !

I can't see the problem with whipping rings on. My only reservation is that manufacturers go way over the top in encasing whippings in big blobs of super-hard epoxy. This is way out of proportion to any wear, stresses or strains whippings have to withstand, and just makes the rings harder to remove should you wish to replace them. I have rods which attack with a hammer would reduce to splinters - plus a set of rings still encased in solid epoxy blobs.

I'm not sure how eg shrink tube or plastic/carbon sleeves would be practical, and certainly not from a diy point of view. Given the taper of a rod, you'd need a whole set of different sized sleeves to accommodate the changing diameter from butt to tip. And if you need to replace say the rings towards the bottom of the top joint, a common place for rings to wear, it's hard to see how sleeves or tube could be pushed over the other rings to reach the right spot. With whipping, it's a piece of cake.

Whippings work fine, keep a diy re-whipping option open, and are a versatile and time-tested method that keep a bit of angler skill - like float making - alive. I only ever use black or dark colours, but people who like more decorative finishes can suit themselves with different colours and styles. Too many things are made these days that can't be repaired or renovated by the user, and I'm not keen for fishing rods to go down that route.

If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it!
And whipping with thread is far from broke!
The companies don’t make general run of the mill rods to be repaired, they make them as cheap throwaway articles. Made with the cheapest for them, parts, to sell at the maximum mark up they can get for them. Try getting a replacement section 2 years on for a rod of this type after they’ve launched their next super duper model, you’ll be very lucky indeed if you do.

All the points made so far about how do you get a replacement tube over existing rigs on the section are well made, you don’t, it is that simple.
As someone who has repaired/made many rods for myself and other people since 1969, you’d be surprised how many rings get damaged and have to be replaced. More so now with anglers not stripping the rods down and packing away in protection tubes to minimise accidental damage.

The problem is, assuming it is a problem, that to bend the rod in a natural curve via the line going to the bait and any hooked fish it needs rings on the rod that have to be fixed on the blank in someway. And now and again a ring may need changing because it gets damaged/broken. Most if not all of the modern insert rings, the inserts are glued in and any bang on the metal housing will and does break the bond between the two parts, the inset invariably getting lost before the owner realises it. A repair if you have the insert can be carried out, but in my experience eventually fails in about 60% of the repairs, even when you use the so-called best types of glues. Facilitating the fitting of a new ring with matching coloured fitting material(s) be that whipping thread or shrink tube type material.

I, nor have any of the specialist rod builders I have ever spoken to, have come across anything that is as durable or practical as whipping thread as an initial fixing material for rod rings.
Yes it not a process that everybody can do and it takes time to learn and do neatly, but done properly it is in my view a thing of beauty!

So no it isn’t broke and it doesn’t need fixing, it just needs learning to do it via practice, to make it perfect.

Just in case anyone is interested in an easy, cheap option - I built a rod dryer a while ago for the princely sum of £4.39 ( the cost of a 220-240VAC 4W 18RPM Synchronous Motor for a Microwave Oven from fleabay). The frame was knocked up from some old bits of MDF shoaled up in the shed with the 'V's' treated to some felt to protect the rod section whilst turning.

That looks like a great contraption for whipping on rings and joint strengthening whippings, and any intermediate whippings BB, it looks like you could also use it for shaping and sanding the corks on the handle and painting any decorative rings on the whippings and/or the blank too. Nice one :thumbs:

If I were still making my own rods I think I would definately try to make one of those myself.

Keith

Molehill said:

It works, it is strong, by the way, many turns of a fine thread are stronger than fewer turns of a thicker thread. Not that there's much in our waters to test a rod to that extent. It looks good when finished, multiple colour choices and tags if so desired, easy to adjust and line up rings. Quick to do, excluding the ring location and epoxy work - which would probably be done anyway - a pro (factory) builder with a turner should do it in 2 minutes easy.
I think it is here to stay.

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Philip said:

It does not surprise me to hear some rod manufacturers are already using alternatives to whippings.

I find it hard to accept that in todays world the best way to attach something to a round pole is to still basically tie it on with thread !

There must be a better way !

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Well it keeps my 21 century trainers on nice and tight. Pete