days and ways films

There are lots of points made in the films that have not been properly discussed yet. For example, to start the ball rolling, what do you all think about hooklengths that are four feet long? It seems to me that if the hook and bait are flapping about just off the floor, it doesn't matter much whether the hooklength is one foot or two feet long. What about deep hooking? Does anyone think that might be a problem?

I don't think a long hook link is necessary all the time. Like many things in fishing, they work best some days and not others; the wise angler will try both when he's not sure.

As for deep hooking, I don't think that's going to happen with barbel. In fact, I'm trying to remember when I last deep-hooked a barbel and I can honestly say that I've caught thousands of them and have never deep-hooked a single one - and I've used short and long hook lengths many, many times.

Anyone else deep-hooked a barbel?

Graham Marsden said:

I don't think a long hook link is necessary all the time. Like many things in fishing, they work best some days and not others; the wise angler will try both when he's not sure.

As for deep hooking, I don't think that's going to happen with barbel. In fact, I'm trying to remember when I last deep-hooked a barbel and I can honestly say that I've caught thousands of them and have never deep-hooked a single one - and I've used short and long hook lengths many, many times.

Anyone else deep-hooked a barbel?

Click to expand...

Only still water ones.........

Underwater shots with sound of pellets being crunched was very interesting. Shows it's not only smell & sight that attracts fish to bait.

Mark Hewitt said:

Only still water ones.........

Click to expand...

Got to admit I haven't caught many stillwater barbel, but none have been deep-hooked.

I'll just have to go out and catch a few more and put it to the test.

Can I just say, before anyone claims otherwise, I played no part in the starting of this discussion and I do not know who the originator is.

I agree there is much to ponder in our films but we do try to leave a degree of interpretation open to the viewer. Two people can watch the same clips and come to different conclusions, that's for sure.

It's unlikely that the third film will be released before next spring which will be a disappointment to some, especially as there's going to be a big chunk of underwater observation and experiments in it. Stu has recorded 20-odd sessions worth of underwater filming so far and there's some amazing stuff to see.

For anyone who wants an exclusive sneak preview of Volume Three I shall be appearing on Tight Lines next week and it's hoped that the show will feature some brand new underwater footage and a taster from a session on the Wye.

Bob Roberts said:

Can I just say, before anyone claims otherwise, I played no part in the starting of this discussion

Click to expand...

Oh yes you did, you produced two damn good videos that inspire discussion

Okay, I admit that much. We made the bloomin' things!

But thanks to whoever it was who made the first comment.

Enjoy next week's show.

I very rarely use a hooklength in excess of 18inches.
I've never deep hooked a barbel either.

Yes Graham deep hooking barbel isnt common on river or stillwater,float or lead.I understand the ideas behind the long hooklinks but also wonder on another of Bob's bones of contention,line that is not pinned onto the river bed,obviously the longer link will be more prone to lifting so more additions must be made to the rig,which is never a good thing in my book.

I use mono hooklinks of up to five feet sometimes.All depends on where i'm fishing and in what conditions.Don't get me wrong,i'd rather use one of 18".On a clear and low river if i think i'll gain an edge i'll use a longer link.Like Graham says,experiment.As for them wafting about,so do free offerings.A couple of medium sized pellets on a size 10 hook are heavy enough to pin down a long link.If you aren't sure,add a touch of "heavy metal"

The shortcomings of short hooklinks in fast water were clearly shown in the DVDs as barbel repeatedly tried to take the hook bait and failed to get hooked.

If you're fishing in slow moving water I'm guessing a short hooklink will be fine but the rivers I fish don't afford me those opportunities.

At the moment I've all on to stop the barbel I'm catching from dragging the rod in before I pick it up. 36 barbel in three short daytime sessions starting at 10am and never lasting longer than 5pm suggest I'm doing something right. This is using a 30 inch Drennan Sinkbraid hooklink to a size 8 Gamakatsu wide gape specialist hook (GP201/202?).

Can someone explain how a short hook link will improve my situation.

Moreover, what are the actual advantages of a short hook link over a long one?

Last post by Bob fascinating. Been using longer hooklengths this season...after reading comments on the matter from Bob, Lee Swords and Sean Meeghan.

Number of barbel caught has increased. Now some of this may be due to fishing a new stretch with more barbel in!!!...But have been lengthening hooklengths each trip and barbel catches increasing. Appreciate that there will other factors involved but it is working for me. River is a small and fast flowing one. All fished hooked in mouth. No deep hooking at all.

The thing is Bob is it down to your 30inch hooklink or your general good technique,you have fished a lot of years now and must know how easy it is to persuade yourself that something is hyper-critical,i would be tempted to try a shorter link just to put my mind at rest,your more than likely correct Bob just as the dvd shows and there must be times when it is the best anyway,ive been trying longer hooklinks myself but the Thames has been fishing like a sewer,so rods arent needed let alone hooklinks.

I have been away fishing the last few days, otherwise I would have input already. If you are reading this Bob, I have bought both films. I have enjoyed them both very much and find both films are absolutely fascinating. As I usually fish the Trent, Lee Swords' section is particularly interesting but I expect to be unpacking the implications of both films for a long time to come. I look forward to seeing Mick Wood in the next film - someone else who has fished the trent and who always has interesting and considered views to put across.

I have fished long hooklengths for a few years now. I have faith in the technique, though I shorten them down to about 18 inches on occasion. As for deep hooking I never have either. I tried stepping down to size 12 Korum hooks. They worked a little too well in some respects. The first fish I caught on them was very firmly hooked in the scissors. It was really quite difficult to get the hook out. It seems to me that the barb is oversized for the hooks. The problem did not recur after I flattened all the barbs. Easy-Peasie after that. I usually flatten all my barbs. I just forgot I guess.
I tried out Korda soft coated braid too. To my amazement it snapped on a knot, when I had a barbel twitch. The knot was the Kryston loop knot, and the braid was not stripped. I changed to a palomar on stripped braid, direct to a swivel and it performed perfectly the next time. I noticed Danny Fairbrass recommending tying to a rig ring. I thought he was just trying to sell more Korda metalware!
I am curious to know what other Trent fishers do to get over the problem of getting the bait out and on the deck in a reasonable quantity.

I've only been on the Trent three times this season, short sessions fished between 10am and 5pm tops. It's fished its proverbial nuts off. 36 barbel so far and on one of these sessions I only fished a sleeper rod as my intention was to catch chub on the stick float (usual drill - it's all in my blog at bobrobertsonline - sorry for the plug mods - at least I've not done it as a link this time!).

My standard approach is to bang out ten to 15 medium sized droppers of hemp and pellets as soon as I arrive at a swim before setting anything else up. It usually takes me 20 minutes to get everything sorted and ready at which point I cast two feeder rods over the baited area.

Touch wood, I've had a fish on either the first or second cast on each occasion to date.

The fish haven't been massive - I wouldn't expect them to be in those numbers - but they battle hard and I go home tired.

I'm using a pellet mix that Stu Walker have been working on with Mistral Baits. Nothing too complicated - mostly small elips, halibuts and feed pellets. Clusters of small pellets glued on a hair and dunked in the old Grubjuice before casting out.

If I couldn't find my bait dropper I'd fish for a different species. Honestly, it's the most important tool a barbel angler carries.

Can't argue with what Bob says. The only thing I do different is that my long hook length is made from 2ft of mono (my reel line) and 6" of Drennan Sinkbraid. This is a lot cheaper than 30" of sinkbraid and seems to tangle less. I use a ledger stop with light feeders and leads and a swivel with heavier feeders.

One thing I would say is that I'd not use the quantity of bait that Bob is using on the rivers I fish (mainly the Wharfe and the Swale). Fine on the Trent with a large head of fish, but not good on some other rivers if you don't know what you are doing. The problem is large quantities of pellets with low quantities of fish (or fish not actively feeding).

Thats a sound idea Sean and gives better stickability to the bottom i would have thought,do you use a small swivel or just knot them together?

I use a small rig ring Alan. It's smaller and neater than a swivel and so I think it's less likely to be noticed by a fish.

One thing I am picky about is making sure that the mono lies flat and has no obvious kinks or curls. If I notice this then I cut off a couple of feet and re-tie my hook length. One advantage of a long length of braid is that it always lies flat.

Ive been using hook lengths of 2 1/2 - 3ft and using Flurocarbon as a hook length.

Im not convinced about the flurocarbon yet but Im sure the longer hook lengths work. I do shorten my hook length at night though and use Gardner Black Silk as a hook length at times, I still feel there is no reason to use flurocarbon at night.

Ive not seen the said DVD's yet