How ethical is this?

I was talking to a guy on the river the other day (serious barbel angler type) who told me about a group of anglers he knew, who are targeting several known large fish. They are using a baiting syndicate to increase the weight of these fish to their maximum weight possible.

So how ethical do you think this sort of action is then?

Swim wild swim free…………………. But don’t forget to eat the super highly nutritional bait we’re attempting to force feed you on!

Phil,
I would suppose that this example is ever so slightly more ethical than, for instance catching the barbel, taking it home and hand rearing it in your garden pond.
Then, claiming the record for "catching" it again

I think that there is a very broad line to be drawn between pre-baiting a swim and a deliberate feeding campaign designed to enhance the weight of these targeted fish.

Was it not Jack Hargreaves who once said "before a man demands to catch a big fish he should succeed in catching wild ones?"

I suppose we all have to draw a line in the sand at some point and syndicated pre baiting with the sole intention of increasing the size of the fish is the wrong side of the line regarding increasing ones angling credentials. It’s a bit like pretending to be a big game hunter and going to the zoo to shoot lions and tigers.

If ever all angling becomes like this I won't be doing it any more.

so whats the difference between there and adams mill or most of the big carp lakes in the country.

Jason the difference is that there is, to my knowledge, no specific plan by an organised group of anglers to ground bait with the sole intention of increasing the fish.

There is one word to describe that kind of behaviour and it is Sad. Such fools deserve your sympathy because they have clearly lost the plot.

Andy,

You are quite right, sympathy is indeed the word.

I looked it up in the dictionary, and found it . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . midway between sh!te and syphilis!

Very apt, IMHO !

Doesn't float my boat, but if it makes someone happy where's the harm in it.

I know, the purists - who I have respect for - will eschew this - but where do you draw the line..? No free offerings at all..?

That fish you caught had stuffed itself on crayfish therefore not as worthwhile as a fish from a non crayfih water..?

Are fish from "poor" waters more worthy..?

It is commonplace on Southern rivers,as it is on stillwaters for Carp.A by product is bigger Chub Roach Tench and Bream.Not my idea of what it is all about but then neither is fishing the waters that are likely to be involved.As for Crayfish Chris I am yet to be convinced that they contribute to fish sizes.Plenty of rivers doing huge fish that do not have Signal or Turkish infestation.

Chris, the point is they are purposely setting out to increase the size of the fish. There is a difference between pre baiting to catch a fish and pre baiting purposely to increase the size of a fish. If on top of this the water is syndicated so that no one else can fish for the targeted fish then the situation gets even worse.
Come on lads there has to be a challenge somewhere in this game but at the end of the day we all draw are own line in the sand by which we wished to be judged. Its no difference between the ethics of using performance enhancing drugs in competitive sports and like it or not the angler who feels he has to unnaturally boost the weight of a fish is doing so out of competitiveness, he wants to be seen better than the rest and weight matters!

sorry to upset you with my last comment john but i was trying to.
my point was adams mill gets people putting in loads of highly nutritional bait all year round as do the carp waters, this unnaturally boosts the weight of the fish in there.
there's very little difference between what these people are doing and the effect of what happens on these waters in my opinion.

oh bugger
that last message should have read,
sorry to upset you with my last comment john but i wasn't trying to.

The irony of my first post is the river he was talking about was the Ribble. A big wide powerful river that moves lots of sediment when up 3 ft. 3 oz of lead just about holds bottom in the slower lengths, with that amount of water running through. With 6ft on, even a house brick wouldn’t hold, so what chance free offerings of boillies or a pellets holding?

The big barbel on the Ribble roam quite large distances and in the length he was referring to, they can roam from Red Scare Weir to the estuary, a river distance of many miles.

Whilst theoretically it’s possible to introduce enough HNB to increase the size of the fish, providing they are static in one area all the time. It’s not I believe the case on the Ribble, as the river is rarely in such stable state for very long. Last summer being the exception to the rule.

Therefore the amount of bait these guys would have to put in to achieve their aim, and taking into account the fact that the smaller siblings would also take their offerings and of course the many chub as well, that equally will take anything the barbel do. Is I think, vast and would run into perhaps hundred weights or more a week, depending on river levels and flow speeds.

There are no crayfish in the river as yet to assist in the weight gain either, and assuming they are responsible for a lot it, as some suggest.

All in all, my private thoughts as he was telling me this were, “what a load of stupid egotistical prats these lot are. They must have far more money than sense.”

The world love a trier, equally it hates a fool, who is easily parted from his money. In this case there would appear to a syndicate of them!

Although I’m sure that there may well be a general increase in the average weight due to pre baiting, it is more likely, that there will also be an increase in general fish numbers. This may have the opposite effect re the growth of very large fish due to too much competition. On the Lune as the very large bags of bream diminished the average size of those left increased dramatically. You may only have caught five fish in a session but the smallest would have been 7lb. I personally think that big fish are more likely to occur where there is an abundance of natural food and no competition from other fish.

sound like you should take up flattie fishing in the estuary phil, they should be getting a good feed by the sound of it.

As Andy said,very sad indeed.

I think there's something lacking in the anglers who DELIBERATELY set out to manufacture a record fish by a pre-baiting regimen. I couldn't hold my head up while claiming a new record if i was them.

eventually these fish, and the anglers will loose all credability. As with rainbow trout the catching of a big fish was an achiement, now does anyone know, or care, what the record is

John,

Is there now 3 of you?A cloning breakthrough in the North East!

Sounds as if they are throwing money away in any event on a big river like the Ribble.

Anglers such as these - to paraphrase - know the size of everything & the value of nothing!