Bailey & Coster – Our Way with…Big Roach

[John Bailey]

Again, I have read all this intently and I actually think we are all right, one way and another, according to our different disciplines. For example, I am not at all surprised that DC has witnessed big roach taken on a line away from the scene of the smaller fish action. That is exactly what I would expect. They are interested in the food but wary of the commotion caused by smaller fish being hooked, so they hang back, and there they are vulnerable if located. If a pike disturbs the smaller roach, or if these thin out and the baited area gets quieter, then probably the big ones will slowly dare to come closer to the feed zone. Nothing in this scenario contradicts what I and others have been saying: if you find (or can see) a big roach and present a bait to it when it is unspooked, it is likely that fish will take it.

Everything is about big roach being confident enough to feed, and that is why the comments on stealth are so pertinent. If you are roach fishing, or fishing for any other river species, the first cast is always the most important and the most likely to be successful. If you can get a bait in there without fish knowing there is danger around, half the job is done. That is why wasting that first cast by plumbing, or checking the float cocks, or whatever, is foolish almost always. As DC says, if you are patient enough to feed the swim for twenty minutes before casting, your chances are vastly increased, and it is almost certain any big roach present are hunting for your bait and likely to take it on first sighting. A dropped box. A banged-in rod rest. A shadow. A heavy footfall. A bad first cast. A missed bite. A fish pricked and lost. All these things diminish your chances enormously.

BTW, Captain Parker is one of our roach heroes. He’s up there with Faddist, Wentworth, Swanton, and all the big guns, past and present.

 

[Peter Jacobs]

Captain L A Parker was at one time the owner/landlord of The Bull at Downton and wrote the 1948 "This Fishing Or Angling Arts and Artifices" which I still have a copy of today. There are some lovely hand drawn ink drawings by a Miss Luckham with one lovely one of Bickton Mill.

The pub was a mecca for visiting anglers for decades until it was "refurbished" (which translates to wrecked) in the early 90's.

Captain Parker was stationed at Old Sarum airfield for many years and died in 1959.

Way back a bunch of us FM members used to meet up on occasion at the Bull for the "Wessex Mafia" evenings with a few beers and a good long chat and a laugh.

 

[Peter Jacobs]

It is funny how the old memory can be kicked into service. I remembered another passage in a book that described a night at the Bull thus, from Arthur Applin in his book "Philandering Angler".

“The evenings at The Bull were rich… I was instantly at home in Miriam, Mrs Parker’s kitchen. At the far end of the room a fire glowed in a long, old-fashioned stove; a kettle steamed, a saucepan emitted an appetising odour. At the long table running the length of the kitchen Capt' Parker was having his supper with a young naval officer on leave. Every evening when the table was finally cleared and the pretty barmaid wished us goodnight, chairs would be pulled closer to the fire, glasses charged again, while smoke rose from pipes and cigarettes…”

Altogether a different and sadly lost period of time . . . .

If memory serves me Captain Parker also wrote the Roach book in the How to Catch them series . . . .

 

[no-one in particular]

It is funny how the old memory can be kicked into service. I remembered another passage in a book that described a night at the Bull thus, from Arthur Applin in his book "Philandering Angler".

“The evenings at The Bull were rich… I was instantly at home in Miriam, Mrs Parker’s kitchen. At the far end of the room a fire glowed in a long, old-fashioned stove; a kettle steamed, a saucepan emitted an appetising odour. At the long table running the length of the kitchen Capt' Parker was having his supper with a young naval officer on leave. Every evening when the table was finally cleared and the pretty barmaid wished us goodnight, chairs would be pulled closer to the fire, glasses charged again, while smoke rose from pipes and cigarettes…”

Altogether a different and sadly lost period of time . . . .

If memory serves me Captain Parker also wrote the Roach book in the How to Catch them series . . . .

I always get them mixed up, the bat and ball and the bull inn. I am pretty sure I have visited both of them, one we got a day ticket from and they had a lovely stretch of the Avon but we caught b all both times. I think it was once in about 1966 with my dad and again in about 1980 with my brother. PS, it was Captain Parker's "How to catch Roach" I got that little tip from about using a dead weight. I never got to read the whole book as I lost it (its a long story) but must replace it sometime.

 

[Peter Jacobs]

The Bull is in Downton and you used to be able to get day tickets there for the stretch behind the pub'. My syndicate stretch is further downstream starting at Hale Bridge.

The Bat and Ball pub' is even further downstream at Breamore (at the end of our syndicate stretch) . . . . I was interested in buying that pub' back in 2001 but the surveyors said it needed a complete new roof (circa £250k) so I decided against it.

If memory serves me you could also get day tickets from the Bat and Ball as well.

Today it is owned by the same people who have the Horse and Groom at Woodgreen and that is a pub' that is about half way along the syndicate stretch and I've often had lunch in there on days when the fish have been hiding.

 

[chevin4]

I have stayed at the Bat and Ball on three occasions the first time in Oct 1977 with my Dad the second time with a good friend in March 1978 and again in Dec 1978. They had a lovely stretch of river I recall which at that time produced quality roach. Unfortunately on each occasions the weather was not kind to us either severely flooded as was the case in Dec 1978 and very low and clear on the other occasions. I seem to recall the accommodation was good and reasonably priced and the food in the restaurant was superb.

 

[no-one in particular]

I am pretty sure now it was the bat and ball stretch I fished as well. It was a lovely bit of river but we blanked both times, probably fished it all wrong. But I have read before it is a very difficult stretch. Must get back there one day.

 

[john step]

If memory serves me Captain Parker also wrote the Roach book in the How to Catch them series . . . .

LIKE THIS ONE PETER??

 

[Peter Jacobs]

Yep, that is the one . . . a lovely little book.

Years ago I started to make a collection of the How to Catch them books, first editions where possible, and a few of them were very costly. They are all in storage now together with most of my other books following my house move.

 

[John Bailey]

Lovely stories all of you, and I have to agree when you talk about the old Bull. I went in first in around 1973. I was keen to see if I could translate what I had learned on the Wensum to the much larger Avon. The truth? I walked the Bull stretch and was terrified. It was just too large, gushing, and powerful for me and, honestly, I can remember the despair I felt to this day. It wasn’t until the mid 80s I dared commit myself again.

But my fishing inadequacies are not the point. Though Captain Parker had died, I remember The Bull with enormous affection. As I recall, one room at least was full of cased fish, and the whole experience was straight out of Crabtree. Mention of Applin’s book is apt. There really was a feel to fishing and the fishing pub then that is dead and buried today. And that brings me to the point of this. Is there a Bull that has escaped the damaging modernity that has brought most pubs to their knees?

I can think of one, perhaps only one, that fills all the criteria we are looking for: The Red Lion in Bredwardine on the middle Wye. Mike Taylor has run this ancient salmon fishing inn since the Eighties, and though barbel are now the mainstay, the spirit of the pub lives on. Yes, there have been changes since I first knew the place decades ago, but none have disrupted that harmony of iconic landlord, ancient bar, and sweet-smelling beer. An open fire from Autumn. A good solid bar menu featuring pies. Talk of fishing 'till long after closing hours. I’m not sure about Izaak Walton’s lavender-smelling sheets, but I always sleep there like a top. Here’s to Mike, and long may The Lion roar.

Your own Capt Parker Fishing Pub nominations? Let’s hear them please... though they’ll have to go some to beat The Lion at its game!

 

[Peter Jacobs]

I cannot, sadly, think of another like the way the Bull used to be.

Another in the similar area however was the Old Beams Inn at Ibsley and that some years ago was a lovely pub' where we'd often take lunch if the fishing was dour

About the same time as the Bull was ruined the Old Beams was as well as it was also "refurbished" and turned into a posh Harvester type establishment. Gone were the scarlet waist coated waiters and the silver service of old . . . I'm talking back in the days when the Somerley and Ibsley stretch was the preserve of Col. Crow . . . .

 

[no-one in particular]

There used to be more than one pub in Ringwood that had the fishy feel. There were lots of stuffed fish and old rods on the walls and as Ringwood attracted a lot of anglers from all over the country, the talk was often good. However, I cannot remember the name of them or what they are like now.

 

[chevin4]

I think the book which really captures the atmosphere of this part of the Avon is A River for All Seasons Tom William's. It's a book I read from time to time which reminds me of the great times I experienced in that lovely part of the country.
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[no-one in particular]

I think the book which really captures the atmosphere of this part of the Avon is A River for All Seasons Tom William's. It's a book I read from time to time which reminds me of the great times I experienced in that lovely part of the country..

I had never heard of it but just got a paperback version for £2.50 off eBay so thanks, it looks like an interesting read.

 

[Peter Jacobs]

I had never heard of it but just got a paperback version for £2.50 off eBay so thanks, it looks like an interesting read.

Then you might also like Frank Sawyer's "Keeper of the Stream" (1952)

Frank was also the inventor of the PTN and a few other patterns as well as some animal traps.

He was the keeper of the 6 mile stretch around Lake House on the Avon which is now owned by pop singer Sting.

He also wrote "Nymphs and the Trout" and if you can get the 2006 printing it includes some of his previous unpublished writings in new chapter.

 

[John Bailey]

Replying to chevin4 and all of you, I sense there is a yearning among many of us roach men for a return to an imagined past when we could sit in Captain Parker’s parlour, and talk the night away about catches made and catches to come. Life was simpler, jobs were for life, and two pound roach were everywhere. But I certainly remember the early Sixties. No central heating. No double glazing. Cars that rusted and broke down. The journey from Manchester to Norfolk taking hours along narrow roads winding through Newark, Sleaford, and every village on the way. Cumbersome rods. Intrepid reels and Luron 2 mono.

Would I personally swap now for what we had then? Well, certainly there has been a shattering silence when I asked for present-day fishing pub nominations. It strikes me, too, that another bigger thing we have lost is any sense of reality, notably when dealing with the countryside. I accept that not all post-war farmers, or game keepers, or water keepers, were enlightened especially, but there was an honest understanding of how the land worked. I was an urban lad who was uprooted to a rural life aged around six, and there is a lot I could say about the country folk that taught me 'till I was in my twenties.

The appallingly woke way we treat conservation seems to me to be holding back any real chance of reform. Let me give an example that left me speechless just last night. I have a secret passion for Darcy Bussell, and an open one for the Outer Hebrides. When I saw she was presenting a programme on North Uist, well, I had to watch. All was well until the action turned to the island’s corncrake population. We all know the UK’s corncrake has crashed these last years, whilst surviving on Uist. Busy birders were happy to tell Darcy about how they worked the grasslands to the corncrakes’ satisfaction and bingo, watch them flourish. What no one mentioned was that there has been a huge trapping exercise on the island to remove the hedgehogs that eat the corncrake eggs. Oh no. In accordance with the modern sanitised portrayal of the countryside, such a revelation would not sit well at all with an audience that knows hardly anything about how nature really works.

It is just the same with river management, of course. The EA are restoring a mile of Wensum belonging to a good friend of mine, and he asked me to comment on the draft plans. They look fine. Deflectors here, gravels there. Trees planted, fry refuges created. It’s all good stuff, but it will make not one damn bit of difference to the ailing (virtually absent) fish stocks. I am sure the EA guys know this. After all, they have been carrying out these improvements for twenty years, with nothing but a decline in fish numbers resulting. They’d have to be bonkers not to recognise this, but like the North Uist birders, they feel it best to gloss over inconvenient truths.

I’d like my cake and to eat it both. I’d like to keep my nice car and my heating, but I’d like a nice fishing pub, two pound roach back, and fishery managers who know the problems, and are not afraid to confront them.

 

[Molehill]

The countryside is mostly portrayed in a sanitised version and the more people see this the more they believe it and want this version of the countryside outside their doors. Even organisations like the RSPB are in a bit of a pickle with their predator control - should they or shouldn't they? Well we know the answer is yes they should and indeed have to in order for some bird species to be saved, but many members are against it. It does make me chuckle that Packham (vice president of RSPB) and mates have been busy causing legal problems for all general licences, whilst the RSPB use the licences to control corvids on some reserves - because there is no option.
My work with the red squirrel conservation here in Wales has been an eye opener to public attitudes, I have been trapping greys around the core area for 6 years now, but there was a lot of resistance to it. The nicest way I can put that! For most people conservation = preservation of everything, they cannot come to grips with the fact that conservation means finding the correct balance of species and that rarely happens naturally in our busy, overpopulated world, we have to guide and that includes culling.

 

[no-one in particular]

I think the book which really captures the atmosphere of this part of the Avon is A River for All Seasons Tom William's. It's a book I read from time to time which reminds me of the great times I experienced in that lovely part of the country..

I have been reading it, a very good read and thanks for the tip Chevin4.

 

[chevin4]

I have been reading it, a very good read and thanks for the tip Chevin4.

You are very welcome. I am very pleased to learn you are enjoying the book.

 

[Peter Jacobs]

It is a very good book and one that I take form the shelves to re-read from time to time.

If memory serves me correctly there was some controversy that his wife was the author rather than himself, but then I think that was down to Tom relating the events and his wife recording them . . . . .