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Nice fish, those Cory's.
I had a couple in my aquarium when I had it, they were more spotted, though.
 

whitty

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Look whatever happens Mike and Ian aren't going to change your minds,even though they haven't much experience of waters with them in,Mike hated them because they are ugly,I don't particularly like pike,but I understand they're benefits,I feel catfish have similar benefits,they also have a downside or two as do pike and zander,zander aren't a native predator,but they are here to stay,cats were in Woburn lakes before I was born,several other waters in Beds and Bucks had them at a similar time,cats were caught in Paxton weirpool 20+ years ago,how many have bred since then,because kittens have been caught,they must be right through the middle and lower Gt.Ouse,Priory lake at Bedford has had them for a long time,this lake connects to the river,the EA made no effort to eradicate them,ever....
 

mikench

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Disease, war, murder, cruelty, deprivation and I could go on,have been with us for centuries. That fact doesn’t make them any more acceptable to me or more likeable now or thousands of years ago. Cats should not be here and knowing mans ability to hunt, fish and generally bring extinction to so many species, we could and should eradicate them and as soon as possible. They have no purpose save to satiate the appetite for people I have no connection with to catch unusual fish which put a bend in a rod. They offer nothing for bio diversity, resolving pollution issues, the life in our rivers and lakes or for anything I can think of. Tell me Alan what advantages do the inhabitants of these small islands derive from their presence. I’m an angler and I detest them and cannot think of any endearing qualities.

I will never be persuaded and whatever I can do I will to eradicate them.
 

whitty

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Well I don't see the harm they have done,any more than pike,grebes and perch which all thrive on the waters with cats,I cannot say any more than that,so going on a crusade seems pointless,unlike signal crayfish and Chinesee mitten crabs which they're damage an be blatantly seen..
 

markg

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Beavers are now breeding wild in Devon, just read this as it happens. Another non native species brought here by good doers and rose tinted spec wearers. Goodbye fishing rights!
 

mikench

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I’m sorry but beavers were indigenous in the Uk until they were hunted to extinction 400 years or so ago. Signal crays need exterminating and are an example of crass stupidity such as the introduction of grey squirrels and Japanese knotweed.Mitten crabs also need exterminating having been inadvertently imported in the bilge tanks of tankers and other large ships. We know enough about allowing the importation ,deliberately or otherwise, of alien species with dreadful consequences. I’m not just talking of the Uk. Look at Australia and cane toads, feral camels, dogs and pigs. Note the damage caused by rats to bird populations on remote islands , the infestation of crops and buildings by termites, Asian hornets, poisonous spiders and more, the release of pythons in Florida and other states. The list is endless and we must learn from those mistakes and not repeat them.
 

markg

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I’m sorry but beavers were indigenous in the Uk until they were hunted to extinction 400 years or so ago. Signal crays need exterminating and are an example of crass stupidity such as the introduction of grey squirrels and Japanese knotweed.Mitten crabs also need exterminating having been inadvertently imported in the bilge tanks of tankers and other large ships. We know enough about allowing the importation ,deliberately or otherwise, of alien species with dreadful consequences. I’m not just talking of the Uk. Look at Australia and cane toads, feral camels, dogs and pigs. Note the damage caused by rats to bird populations on remote islands , the infestation of crops and buildings by termites, Asian hornets, poisonous spiders and more, the release of pythons in Florida and other states. The list is endless and we must learn from those mistakes and not repeat them.
I will have to disagree with you on them being indigenous after 400 years of absence, they will certainly be an imposter with no natural balance with our existing flora and fauna after 400 years, they are as much a foreign invasion as anything else is. And a vastly changed landscape flora and fauna after 400 years is not the same habitat they once inhabited; not automatically suited to them as it once was, this is just an assumption and an excuse to release them by those that think they have the right. I hope it is not anyway, perhaps they will not breed to pest numbers. They could do a lot of damage if they do and I can foresee restrictions to fishing rights coming our way in the meantime either way. catfish could be a small problem by comparison if I am right.
Let nature take its natural course, if a critter finds itself a home and thrives then fair enough, everything else can learn to survive with it and slowly as nature can take care of it and adapt, when humans come along and dump there latest fad in the middle of it, it does work.
 
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whitty

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Talking about eradicating something that no experience of the creature involved is exactly why humans make mistakes,rather than make an effort to eradicate signal crayfish,instead of giving up the ghost and allowing them to continue on their march,everyone has the right to an opinion,but usually there is a basis to this,not what someone says about the Ebro,no water in this country has had species loss due to catfish that i've heard of,pike have eradicated crucian carp from two prolific waters I know,add this to the fact that even electro fishing or netting never catches everything...
 

tigger

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Look whatever happens Mike and Ian aren't going to change your minds,even though they haven't much experience of waters with them in

No idea where you got that info from Alan?

I have a water I have fished regularly only a dozen miles from me where wels were illegally introduced, and so yeah, I do have experience of them.

If you genuinely can't see that introducing such an invasive species can and will cause serious problems to our ecosystem then you need some education.

As an example, mink were released by the same kind of pricks as release the wels. Since the release of mink, water voles have become very scarce, tell me how often you see a stoat or a weasle run across the roads nowadays, . Since thw grey squirrels were introduced, red squirrels are for the biggest part extinct!

Would you have advocated the release of them?

Anglers who advocate the introduction of wels have no interest in the rammifications of doing so, so long as they can catch them without travelling to foreign climbs.
 

whitty

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But they are not mink,if you can tell me that the venue you have experience of has been ruined ok,but not one venue in my area shows that,and this is where it started way back when,ok hard waters,stayed hard with hem there,but nothing changed....as it happens I see a few weasels and stoats,my missus asked me what it was running across the road as she had never seen one....that said,I see more otters,but they are bigger...
 

tigger

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But they are not mink,if you can tell me that the venue you have experience of has been ruined ok,but not one venue in my area shows that,and this is where it started way back when,ok hard waters,stayed hard with hem there,but nothing changed....as it happens I see a few weasels and stoats,my missus asked me what it was running across the road as she had never seen one....that said,I see more otters,but they are bigger...

Again, how can any self respecting angler moan about otters, or any of our own natural fish eating predators and yet be in favour of introducing huge invasive fish eating machines, doesn't make sense!
The reason is because the anglers in question are selfish idiots with no concern for their actions so long as they get what they want. They are like a alcoholic, smoker or drug addict, what ever you say to them they will come up with some answer to justify their wants!

I forgot to mention a fishery only several miles away from me which specializes in wels and exotic fish species. This fishery legaly has wels cats and has designated purpose dug pools for them. One of the chaps who looks after them told me they are not a fish you should put anywjere but a designated prison pool because of the damage they will cause. He told me that they have bred readily and he has to monitor the size of the carp in the pools with them because if the carp are below a certain size the cats will consume them. I've spoken to him a number of times as the fishery owns the local tackle shop.
His words were that introducing them into the wild over here would be a disastour.
 

mikench

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When Sam put up this thread he really put the cat amongst the pigeons. As an aside the only real predator of mink are otters who won't tolerate them in their territory. They just kill them. I wonder if otters eat cats.
 

silvers

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When Sam put up this thread he really put the cat amongst the pigeons. As an aside the only real predator of mink are otters who won't tolerate them in their territory. They just kill them. I wonder if otters eat cats.
I wonder if they eat Beavers? ;)
 

Ray Roberts

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You may be able to kill a few but they are established in some of our river systems. In the same way you can net out signal crayfish or stamp on those you catch but you won’t totally eradicate them.

How would you remove them from a huge river like the Thames or the Trent? It just isn’t possible once they are established.


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Philip

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There seems to be 2 different discussions on this thread.

The first is about the stocking of Cats into UK waters which I think pretty much everyone agrees is not a great idea. However the fact is they have been present in the UK since the 1800s ...lakes like Claydon and Woburn had them for years and even Wilstone at Tring threw up the one time British record, from memory 43.8 to a Pike angler. They are already present in the river systems so its too late to stop things now. I think Badgenerale got it about right when he said its like Zander, they will spread, there wont be any apocalypse and most people will ignore the rules.

The second discussion is about the fish themselves and the apparent mindless eating machines that cause an environmental disaster wherever they are present. However, at least to me, that does not appear to be the reality when you dig down on the subject.
 

mikench

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Philip, i can admire the majesty of the Tiger and lion indeed all the big cats. One has to accept that Sharks and Orcas are streamlined killing machines and very handsome in a piscatorial way, most fish we catch are very pretty. Elephants and giraffes are unusual but magnificent. Many flying insects are stunning in colour and aerial ability.

Then we have the Wels catfish which is none of the above. In short it's fugly . It has no majesty, beautiful coloration or any endearing qualities. It's an overgrown slug which consumes whatever it can swallow and I for one cannot find it in my heart to say anything nice about it. I struggle to find the same level of malevolence and dislike for any other living creature.

They should not be in our waters and it's never too late to eradicate or at least to substantially reduce their numbers.
 

Pete Shears

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We need to train/selectively breed wels to eat only cormorants . . . . . .
 
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