Ancient and Modern

[Graham Marsden (ACA)]

Jeff wrote: "Trouble with this new WYSIWYG posting stuff is some combinations of characters will transcribe into emoticons."

Which is quite right, but I'm sure our techies will have it sorted before too long. In the meantime, beware of brackets/forum/smilies/smile_smiley.gif. I've deleted the one that Alan refers to.

 

[Alan Tyler]

For that, and the kind words, many thanks!

Was it because I said "Butt", I wonder?

 

[Wolfman Woody]

Very sorry, Kevin. I remember you you wanted to keep the dress idea under your hat, the one with the pink ribbon and feather around. It was a very nice ensemble though and I'm sure no-one would have known otherwise if you hadn't taken the blonde wig off.

 

[Neneman Nick]

Allthis cobblers about old tackle being consigned tobeing hung up on walls so folk can just look at it and remember the good old days etc..... if it caught fish back then,then surely it can catch fish now.

How many folk still usecane rods and catch plenty....i bet there are a fair few???How many folk still use old porcupine quills and cork bodied bobbers and traditional style avon floats and catch plenty....i do and i bet others out there do as well??? How many folk still use their old mitchell matchreels and catch plenty with them....i do andagain it`s a fair bet that others out there do as well???

Sure i like to have a bash at catfishing with my 3lbs tcnash rods,sure i like to go lure fishing with my fox jigmaster rod,sure i love my j wilson avon quiver,my fox barbel rod and my carp poles etc..... but i just adore using my intrepid reel,my mitchell reel,my old bakelite pins,my old 70`s hollow fibre rods,which incidentaly have caught carp to13lbs.Seeing one of myold porcupine quills or perch bobbers or a celluloid waggler dipping under the water when a fish has taken the bait, in all honesty gives me more pleasure than watching a drennan float go under etc....

I just get a feeling of great satisfaction,pleasure using older tackle andgetting that wow factor from folk who say"blimey,you caught it on that...i used toown one of those rods etc..." or "seeing that old rod brings back some memories".

For all it`s merits,newer modern stuff i feel has no soul or character.

So go a head and use all the modern stuff but don`t poo poo the older pieces of tackle and the folk who enjoy the pleasure it brings.

 

[The Monk]

I just get a feeling of great satisfaction,pleasure using older tackle and for all it`s merits,newer modern stuff i feel has no soul or character.

yeah dead right Nick, I`m polishing up me old pike gaff as we speak

 

[Kevin Perkins]

Jeff

Thanks, apparentlythe parcel yousent me in a plain brown wrapper is awaiting my return at home,I can hardly wait to see what's in it..........!

If Graham will allow, I will do an 'Ancient & Modern MkII' piece and give some serious considerationas to how I thought the various pieces performed on their own merit, and compared to their contemporaries

 

[Ron 'The Hat' Clay AMIMechE (SA) MIFE (SA) (ACA)]

The problem with modern rods Nick is that they lose their soul when they are painted up to look like a Christmas tree.

Why do a lot of modern manufacturers have to put their names on in bl**dy big letters. Why do a lot of reel manufacters have to put all that silly, idiotic brain deadening "Bling" on their reels. Matt black or dark grey looks much better. And have you seen some of the poles lately? All they have to do is inscribe the manufacturers name and model in 1/8" high lettering in a place on the pole or rod where it can't be seen.

 

[Nigel Connor(ACA ,SAA)]

Couldn't agree more Graham.I am more than happy for any thread to veer into other territory as long as its positive and interesting.I cannot resist having a little parry with Ron though from time to time.

It's all a bit of a non-argument though at the end of the day.You said it elsewhere.Fishing is about enjoyment.If you enjoy the old tackle then use it withoutfeeling anyneed to justify it to anyone.

 

[Robert Woods (ACA)]

One downside of modernfishing is "tackle tarting". ie I am going to try fishing with two rods on River Severn but they are not a matched pair.../forum/smilies/confused_smiley.gif.

 

[Bob "chubber"Lancaster (ACA)]

Well folks i use (old tckle) as you put it .I own now some 10 split cane rods Ranging from spinners to float rods and love them all.I use mitchell 300s and of course i have 5 pins too.Masses of cork bobbers and quills an old wicker basket to sit on split cane rod rests hand made for me and a whole cane landing net handle.As someone said they caught fish when they were made and boy they still catch fish now.On a two and a half hour session one evening arounda month ago on my good for nothing old split cane 12' float rod i had a mix of 72 roach/ rudd .On many visits to my local little river i have had on my crochetty old 10' avon some lovely chub ranging from 3 to just under six pounds i,v had bream to five tench and even some nice perch.And all these old rods handled them very well.Ok i do understand that someday i'm gonna get clobbered by a nice carpbut ,well thats the fun init. And also in the closed season next year i have 3 splits to completely strip and refurbish ........ Do you guys with that modern gear get that much fun form your carbon. No i bet ya dont well you stick with yours and i'll stick with mine ,Why because it makes me happy thats why. Thats why i fish cos it makes me happy and thats what its all about when it boils down to it. FUN ? So by all means have your modern gear i'll not complain or put you down for it cos it makes you happy. When i'm dead and gorn my missus can hang them on the wall or even burn them, but until that day i'll carry on and fish with them .Oh and another thing,I was walking down the river last week and heard two fish talking andone said to the other,now bert what are we going for tonight ,the bloke with the 16 mtr pole ,the bloke with the carbon rod or shall we go old fasioned and try the split cane man. I dont know these fish are getting more intelligent every day what. Tight lines all

 

[darkuser80]

I have fished with cane for more years than I care to remember, I have inherited it, bought it new and from auction. Other than compliments I do not worry what people assume or think when they see me fishing with my cane rod, basket, rod rest, tri pod and landing net & handle. Whether it be a James or a Barder, whatever, I fish for the enjoyment and pleasure. Sure I like to catch, Pike Perch Carp Chub, spin, ledger or freeline or float, its all fun. I was once told by an elderly fisherman, nothing is new its only applied in a different manner. If I blank I blank.

If you use carbon or boron rod or pole or telescopic, power to you and enjoy. So when you see me fishing with my little bit of cane, I’m not harking back to the old days.... Stuff that, I enjoy using cane.

To finish a little story (also about manners).......

I was fishing on the Thames targeting some nice Barbel and Chub. I had waded out and was rolling down stream when a noise made me turn around, there was a family standing watching me... track suits and trainers.... I nodded acknowledgement and carried on... The young boy enquired “ Mister can’t you f*cking afford carbon” and the whole pack whooped with laughter.

I was very tempted to force my Barder up his ar*e...

 

[Wolfman Woody]

"the parcel yousent me in a plain brown wrapper is awaiting my return at home,I can hardly wait to see what's in it..........!"

Well, you said not to include any "inflatable gear" so I couldn't send you the rubber dinghy for a start.

There is, however, another item of rubber manufacture that you might find interesting and the email I sent you describes what the plastic bits are for. NOT to be used as handcuffs!

 

[Nigel Connor(ACA ,SAA)]

Waste of a good Barder.

I'd have been too busy laughing at you rolling downstream to have worried about what rod you were using?!?

 

[darkuser80]

Ok.....you know what I mean...........

 

[Ron 'The Hat' Clay AMIMechE (SA) MIFE (SA) (ACA)]

I'll tell you what Bob, I'll bet you use mono lines and lead free shot and Drennan hooks though.

I have an old packet of Allcocks Model Perfects if you want them, plus 2 hooks I would never give away. They were given to me by **** Walker and were hand made in Redditch in the late Victorian period. They are superb.

I often wonder when this penchant for vintage tackle ever came about. My friend Derek who is an angling historian of note tells me it started ca 1978 and was taken up by comparitively young anglers! I can certainly find no evidence of the desire to use old tackle prior to this date.At the moment I am reading "Coarse Fishing" by H.T. Sheringham which was published in 1912. I have also read many other old books including those by JW Martin and GEM Skues and can find no evidence at all suggesting the use of what would be vintage tackle to them. All these writers were forward looking; they used and recommended the best tackle that was available to them.

Sheringham writes:

"I have no hesitation in upholding split cane as the best material for a single handed fly rod, if only on the score of its trustworthyness. Greenheart is its most serious rival, and so far as action goes it is not inferior, perhaps some men find that greenheart suits them better, and if pleasanter to fish with. On this head I have no quarrel with it at all, and like it very much. But personally I have smashed so many greenheart rods in the act of casting, or by getting hitched up trees or herbage , that I find it inadequate for my rough methods."

Split cane in those days must have been viewed in a similar way to how carbon fibre is considered today, and Sheringham, being forward looking, was adivising anglers to go for the latest materials.

For my own part I saw the advent and development of glass fibre in the 60s. Initially glass fibre was pretty awful stuff and most top anglers continued to use split cane. The change came about 1963 I think when excellent glass fibre blanks became available. This culminated in **** Walker being the first manto catch a trout on a carbon fibre rod in 1969.

 

[Ron 'The Hat' Clay AMIMechE (SA) MIFE (SA) (ACA)]

And further:

"Our forefathers had a short way of providing these things (rods). The rod cut from the nearest spinney, the line plucked from the tail of the nearest stallion, the bait dug from thesoil or gathered fom the herbage, the hook fashioned crudelyby amateur smithery, the net constructed in the home - this apparatus involving a little trouble. but practically no expense.

I suppose we could all do this now and still find some sport, but for my own sport I frankly confess that I like modern conveniences, and I like varnish, enamel, and the other superficial attractions of the age which you will find in the tackle shop.

There are moments when the call of the past is very insistant, and I have often longed to have a day's fishing in the 17th century when fishers were comparitively few and fishes correspondingly complaisant. But in dreaming of such a possibility I have contemplated being without 20th century paraphernalia. Walton had no reel and I certainly would not be happy nowadays without a reel."

Hugh Tempest Sheringham - 1912

 

[Ron 'The Hat' Clay AMIMechE (SA) MIFE (SA) (ACA)]

And I'll bet if you could do a time warp and travel back to 1880 and present old Trent Otter with a modern carbon fibre rod from the stable of Harrison, he would whoopwith delight and consign his East India cane and greenheart creations to the bonfire.

 

[Nigel Connor(ACA ,SAA)]

What Sheringham is not doing in those beautifully written passages is telling anyone else what they must do, merely outlining his personal preferences.At the end of the daythis is really what it is all about.

I think some of Sheringham's works are available in peprback re-issues from the Medlar Press.

 

[Ron 'The Hat' Clay AMIMechE (SA) MIFE (SA) (ACA)]

If you want to read a bookby the utimate "pompous prat", read "The Angler's Instructor" by William Bailey published in 1857.

In that book he tells you what you MUST do!

No relation to the current JB I think.

 

[Peter Jacobs]

Sherringham wrote:

"I have contemplated being without 20th century paraphernalia. Walton had no reel and I certainly would not be happy nowadays without a reel."

I guess he'd have never wanted to try pole fishing then Ron, regardless of how 'forward thinking' he was?