Wild carp

[Cakey]

I see

 

[john charlton 2]

i used to be in a little club and one of there waters had true wildies inbut saying that there were also a lot of wildie/ghostie hybrids and they didnt half move/forum/smilies/wink_smiley.gif

same as what the others said there a weird( barbel ) shape with a big tail they were mainly 3-4lb but ive had them to 7lb which is big.

when you hit these fish you think youve hooked a monster you want to try and land one foulhooked in the tail as i have/forum/smilies/tongue_out_smiley.gif

 

[Graham Whatmore]

This is picture and description of a wild carp I picked up off the web but in truth it doesn't look that different to Claudia and Mike's carp so who knows eh!

I remember when I first started targetting and catching carp in the early seventies (before the days of stocking) when carp were present because they had always been there, guys much wiser than me would say "thats a nice wildie" and I didn't honestly see what the difference was between the wildie and the smaller common. Because they weren't overfed like todays carp, I caught all mine on bread both floating and on the bottom, they were all sleek and torpedo shaped and went like stink when hooked.

I wonder how many anglers have caught a sleek torpedo shaped common and called it a wildie ?

 

[Cakey]

does say darker backs !

 

[The Monk]

Graham that appears to be a poor drawing of a wildie, wildies used to vary from water to water of course both in shape and colouration, the classic wildie shape was torpedoed with high shoulders, these wewre the classical wildie lines, but yuou also have to remember that a wildie is genetically no different than a king common, the wildies term is applicable to a carp in time, an intruduced specie prior to genetic modification, ie the UK introduced carp unmodified. You can never be certain a wildie is a wildie if king strain variants exist in the water, ie a water with ghost carp in it is unlikely to support a wildie population, or iof it did in the introduction of ghosties, the gene pool would very soon ameliorate and become unpure.

 

[The Monk]

adverts like this dont help, advertising high double wildies, they obviously have a different idea about what a wildie actually is???

http://www.bigfishholidays.com/Redmill/thefishR.htm

 

[The Monk]

heres another one, these people have no idea, if its long lean and fully scaled they think its a wildie, what rubbish, in honest I doubt any true wildies still exist in the UK, it would certainly be difficult to prove, just one king variant dropped into such water would poplute the gene pool forever

http://www.greenbankshotel.co.uk/grdn.html

 

[The Monk]

, the same has happened in the UK of course,
Scientists from Japan have discovered that the native strain of the wild carp (Cyprinus carpio) in Japan is in danger of extirpation via large-scale introductions of domesticated strains from Eurasia.

In a study published in a recent issue of the journal Molecular Ecology, Kohji Mabuchi, Hiroshi Senou and Mutsumi Nishida conducted a survey of mitochondrial DNA sequences (complete D-loop region) from wild carp collected from 11 localities in Japan.

The authors identified 14 different haplotypes of domesticated carp from Japan, of which 13 haplotypes were deeply nested within a clade consisting of other Eurasian haplotypes.

The significance of this study is that there appears to be large-scale hybridization between Eurasian and Japanese strains of carp within Japan (as a result of 10 million domesticated common carp being introduced into Japanese ecosystems every year until the spread of KHV in 2004).

This dilution of the genotype of the native strain of carp in Japan is worrying, the authors surmise, as ?...the Japanese native common carp is the most basal strain of the species identified to date...? and ?...it is important to conserve this strain in order to maintain the genetic diversity of the species.?

For more information see the paper: Mabuchi K, H Senou and M Nishida (2008) Mitochondrial DNA analysis reveals cryptic large-scale invasion of non-native genotypes of common carp (Cyprinus carpio) in Japan. Molecular Ecology 17, pp. 796?809.

 

[barbelbonce]

I would like to congratulate The Monk on his first sentenceof his post of 12 May in this thread; the longest sentence ever seen on FM - true stream-of-consciousness stuff! Also, his thoughts on this subject are thought-provoking and(for me) educational. p.s. - what is a haplotype?

 

[Peter Jacobs]

A haploid is the short form for a haploid genotype.


Now, did I 'google' that or did I know it?

 

[Cakey]

your clever........................you googled

 

[The Monk]

thanks Bouncybarbeller, a haplotype is as Peter says the genotype, its the genetic makeup, the none visual if you like, the opposite to this is of course the phenotype (what it looks like), which i would have though was more applicable in wildies?? so much for my MSc in Ecology

 

[Mr Cholmondeley-Corker (PaSC)]

I've said it before...is ther no end to this man's tallents?

 

[The Monk]

off the top of me head, Ploidy is the number of homologous sets of chromosomes in a biological cell . The ploidy of cells can vary within an organism. In humans, most cells are diploid (containing one set of chromosomes from each parent), but sex cells ( sperm and egg ) are haploid. In contrast, tetraploidy (four sets of chromosomes) is a type of polyploidy and is common in plants , and not uncommon in amphibians , reptiles , and various species of insects/forum/smilies/smile_smiley.gif

 

[Mr Cholmondeley-Corker (PaSC)]

Crikey /forum/smilies/smile_smiley.gif

 

[Cakey]

blimey.........................keep on shredding

 

[The Monk]

/forum/smilies/smile_smiley.gifI am, I am

 

[barbelbonce]

Well, you never stop learning!

Where does triploid come into this and why are triploid trout (among other species) infertile?

(I've just spotted a connection: Monks live in cells....!!).

 

[Geoff Brown]

Weren't verified UK 'wildies' caught by Matt Hayes and/or Mick Brown for 'the Great Rod Race' series?

Just checked, and the site says they did: the Great Rod Race

Hope that helps.

 

[The Monk]

<blockquote class=quoteheader>barbelbonce wrote (see)</blockquote><blockquote class=quote>

Well, you never stop learning!

Where does triploid come into this and why are triploid trout (among other species) infertile?

(I've just spotted a connection: Monks live in cells....!!).</blockquote>
I live in a cave on`t Oldham Peat Bogs