R
Ron 'The Hat' Clay (ACA-Life Member)
Guest
Sorry Baz, it's spelt: DRAKENSBERG.
B
BAZ (Angel of the North) aka Fester
Guest
You admit we gave them a pasting then?
K
Kevin Perkins
Guest
Ron
?Right Kevin, I truly respect and like your articles but what you have just written is utter B******ks!!"Exclusive gentleman's club" - again I say b*****ks!!?
?No-one, and I repeat no-one, can ever consider themselves to be a competent angler if they can't fly fish?
If this first phrase is a an example of you respecting someone?s opinion, then the second must not be the example of you making a statement based on arrogance beyond belief.
The object of my article was that, in my opinion, the contributors of a certain magazine were bemoaning the fact that they were losing waters to commercial carp interests, and were left with a diminishing number of venues where they could fly fish for trout.
They appeared not to countenance the notion that they could fly fish for any other species of fish, and although there were fewer trout fishing venues and therefore a reduction in competition was keeping ticket prices high, this was in no way the fault of the fly fishers for not visiting the now unavailable fisheries, They seemed to expect that the owners should keep them open regardless of a small matter of not being able to make money.
Not quite sure how to exactly label that kind of myopic self-interest, but arrogance does spring to mind.
If an angler can?t or has no interest in learning to fly fish, he is apparently a lesser person for it, in your opinion. Then, as you probably already know, there are probably millions of anglers you must hold in contempt for their lack of ability, perhaps many of them just didn?t realise before what it entails to be regarded a proper fishermen, by those who are their peers.
As for what I write, as probably the most prolific contributor to FM I am well aware that a lot of it is neither informative, packed with handy hints or tips, nor stuffed with reminiscences of my days spent with giants of the angling world, or constant references to a previous living standard I enjoyed in another country. No, it is merely written in an attempt to entertain on a slightly different level, I just never realised I had sunk to the level of churning out B******ks!!
For that, I can only apologise. My next article is already written, and perhaps prophetically it is about the future of FM, a future which will so obviously be better off without my inane ramblings, so I will make it the last.
As long as my FM membership isn?t cancelled, myself and Herbert Henshall will continue to contribute to the forums under the nom de plume double act of ?Carping & Sniping?
Goodbye for now
Kevin
?Right Kevin, I truly respect and like your articles but what you have just written is utter B******ks!!"Exclusive gentleman's club" - again I say b*****ks!!?
?No-one, and I repeat no-one, can ever consider themselves to be a competent angler if they can't fly fish?
If this first phrase is a an example of you respecting someone?s opinion, then the second must not be the example of you making a statement based on arrogance beyond belief.
The object of my article was that, in my opinion, the contributors of a certain magazine were bemoaning the fact that they were losing waters to commercial carp interests, and were left with a diminishing number of venues where they could fly fish for trout.
They appeared not to countenance the notion that they could fly fish for any other species of fish, and although there were fewer trout fishing venues and therefore a reduction in competition was keeping ticket prices high, this was in no way the fault of the fly fishers for not visiting the now unavailable fisheries, They seemed to expect that the owners should keep them open regardless of a small matter of not being able to make money.
Not quite sure how to exactly label that kind of myopic self-interest, but arrogance does spring to mind.
If an angler can?t or has no interest in learning to fly fish, he is apparently a lesser person for it, in your opinion. Then, as you probably already know, there are probably millions of anglers you must hold in contempt for their lack of ability, perhaps many of them just didn?t realise before what it entails to be regarded a proper fishermen, by those who are their peers.
As for what I write, as probably the most prolific contributor to FM I am well aware that a lot of it is neither informative, packed with handy hints or tips, nor stuffed with reminiscences of my days spent with giants of the angling world, or constant references to a previous living standard I enjoyed in another country. No, it is merely written in an attempt to entertain on a slightly different level, I just never realised I had sunk to the level of churning out B******ks!!
For that, I can only apologise. My next article is already written, and perhaps prophetically it is about the future of FM, a future which will so obviously be better off without my inane ramblings, so I will make it the last.
As long as my FM membership isn?t cancelled, myself and Herbert Henshall will continue to contribute to the forums under the nom de plume double act of ?Carping & Sniping?
Goodbye for now
Kevin
E
ED (The ORIGINAL and REAL one)
Guest
Kevin
Take no notice of the silly old fart ......
We ALL know what a load of B******S he usually churns out in his daily ramblings about:
1) How he hates Scousers
2) Him and a place he loves SO much that he now chooses to live HERE and not there
3) Him and his boyfriend Richard
4) How he hates this government,this country and its youth
5) How much money he makes
Take no notice of the silly old fart ......
We ALL know what a load of B******S he usually churns out in his daily ramblings about:
1) How he hates Scousers
2) Him and a place he loves SO much that he now chooses to live HERE and not there
3) Him and his boyfriend Richard
4) How he hates this government,this country and its youth
5) How much money he makes
John Wesley
New member
- Joined
- Jan 27, 2006
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- 0
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- 0
do not know you ron , do not wish to know you so here goes, why don,t you f*** o** back to SA with all the other right wing racist biggots
F
Fred Bonney
Guest
??????
Not very Christian!!!
Kevin,take no notice of the old duffer.
We all like the b******s, you write.;o)
Not very Christian!!!
Kevin,take no notice of the old duffer.
We all like the b******s, you write.;o)
R
Ron 'The Hat' Clay (ACA-Life Member)
Guest
OK, I will try to explain myself.
There are two things I hate in my life. The first is snobbery. The other is inverted snobbery.
Your statements about fly fishing gave me the impression Kevin that you just might percieve that fly fishers are snobs. To be honest, I have not met one really keen fly fisher in my life that has been a snob. The only aspects of snobbery I have ever noticed connected to fly fishing has come from non-anglers.
"To some outsiders, the prospect of taking up fly fishing is akin to joining an exclusive gentlemen's club."
Where on earth did you get that reasoning from. Think again mate.
"Cost of equipment and day tickets"
It costs far less for fly tackle than what the average coarse fisher in this country carts around on the bankside I can assure you.
My own fly fishing for trout, costs me less that ?2.50 a day, which is a fraction of what it might cost on the average commercial fishery in this area when you add bait, groundbaits and other bits and bobs.
"The mystery of casting!!"
Come on, it's now 2006, there is no mystery to casting a fly, it's a simple process that can easily be learned by anyone.
"Knowledge of entomology."
I could fill a page of A4 with what most fly fishers need to learn about entomology to enable you to devise and tie simple imitations of the things that trout and other fish eat.
"The Club".
No such thing exists!!
I may have gone a little OTT regarding my statement about non-fly fishers not being competent anglers and for that I apologise. "Complete", would have been a better word.
I and many others have fought for years against the notion that fly fishing is elite. It is nothing of the sort. All it is is a form of angling that is most enjoyable, utilises the minimum of gear and is most user friendly.
And I invite anyone who thinks that either I, or others, are sobbish or elite, to join me for a day's fishing.
You will find that we are just not like that.
There are two things I hate in my life. The first is snobbery. The other is inverted snobbery.
Your statements about fly fishing gave me the impression Kevin that you just might percieve that fly fishers are snobs. To be honest, I have not met one really keen fly fisher in my life that has been a snob. The only aspects of snobbery I have ever noticed connected to fly fishing has come from non-anglers.
"To some outsiders, the prospect of taking up fly fishing is akin to joining an exclusive gentlemen's club."
Where on earth did you get that reasoning from. Think again mate.
"Cost of equipment and day tickets"
It costs far less for fly tackle than what the average coarse fisher in this country carts around on the bankside I can assure you.
My own fly fishing for trout, costs me less that ?2.50 a day, which is a fraction of what it might cost on the average commercial fishery in this area when you add bait, groundbaits and other bits and bobs.
"The mystery of casting!!"
Come on, it's now 2006, there is no mystery to casting a fly, it's a simple process that can easily be learned by anyone.
"Knowledge of entomology."
I could fill a page of A4 with what most fly fishers need to learn about entomology to enable you to devise and tie simple imitations of the things that trout and other fish eat.
"The Club".
No such thing exists!!
I may have gone a little OTT regarding my statement about non-fly fishers not being competent anglers and for that I apologise. "Complete", would have been a better word.
I and many others have fought for years against the notion that fly fishing is elite. It is nothing of the sort. All it is is a form of angling that is most enjoyable, utilises the minimum of gear and is most user friendly.
And I invite anyone who thinks that either I, or others, are sobbish or elite, to join me for a day's fishing.
You will find that we are just not like that.
Deanos
Well-known member
Kevin, your ?angle on angling? is humorous and observant?don?t end it all, think of your children, your fans on FM, Ron drinks meths by the crateful and doesn?t know what he is saying half the time (well he did when he called me a turd!).
I have only been a member of the FM ?community? for a short while, I absolutely respect those guys on here who are excellent anglers, and give so much help and advice, I think the diversity of characters, Baz and Ron as examples are brilliant,
And you are a very good writer and make me laugh, in fact you make me laugh as much as my old uncle ?Pan arse? used to when he took his teeth out and gurned at us kids through a toilet seat (usually just after he had been sitting on it!).
I have only been a member of the FM ?community? for a short while, I absolutely respect those guys on here who are excellent anglers, and give so much help and advice, I think the diversity of characters, Baz and Ron as examples are brilliant,
And you are a very good writer and make me laugh, in fact you make me laugh as much as my old uncle ?Pan arse? used to when he took his teeth out and gurned at us kids through a toilet seat (usually just after he had been sitting on it!).
R
Ron 'The Hat' Clay (ACA-Life Member)
Guest
Aren't you supposed to Gurn through an old horse collar Deanos?
And that brings me to another point.
What has happened to the gurning contests of yester-year. These were a great Yorkshire tradition, together with drinking a yard of ale and Morris Dancing.
The last time I saw Morris Dancers was when I lived in Warwickshire. Every summer a number of Morris Men would entertain us on a summer Sunday afternoon at our local in Offchurch. It was just the thing after a session after the chub on the Leam to pop up to the Stags Head and to have a cold beer and watch the Morris Dancers.
And then there were the bell ringers - campanologists they called themselves. The Church at Offchurch had the most wonderful peal of bells. Its funny, but when the bell ringers and the Morris men came to our village they always arrived in a couple of hired mini-buses.
When they got out of the mini-buses you could see the packs of lager in the back.
I remember when a group of bell ringers came to Offchurch from Stratford. Apparently they had had a couple of sessions on the bells in Warwick and by the time they got here, were very well oiled.
I've never quite heard a peal of bells like that one. It sounded like hammers in a breakers yard.
And that brings me to another point.
What has happened to the gurning contests of yester-year. These were a great Yorkshire tradition, together with drinking a yard of ale and Morris Dancing.
The last time I saw Morris Dancers was when I lived in Warwickshire. Every summer a number of Morris Men would entertain us on a summer Sunday afternoon at our local in Offchurch. It was just the thing after a session after the chub on the Leam to pop up to the Stags Head and to have a cold beer and watch the Morris Dancers.
And then there were the bell ringers - campanologists they called themselves. The Church at Offchurch had the most wonderful peal of bells. Its funny, but when the bell ringers and the Morris men came to our village they always arrived in a couple of hired mini-buses.
When they got out of the mini-buses you could see the packs of lager in the back.
I remember when a group of bell ringers came to Offchurch from Stratford. Apparently they had had a couple of sessions on the bells in Warwick and by the time they got here, were very well oiled.
I've never quite heard a peal of bells like that one. It sounded like hammers in a breakers yard.
Deanos
Well-known member
Ron, most of the men in Yorkshire are now so ugly, we get the handsome ones to put the horse collar on, give us a smile?and then we all laugh at them!?honestly Ron, you shall be asking where all the slim men in Yorkshire have gone next tut!
Deanos
Well-known member
Morris dancing! BELL RINGING!? what have you been drinking Ron?
R
Ron 'The Hat' Clay (ACA-Life Member)
Guest
Orange juice and tea.
When I was in my early teens, I occasionally used to ring the bell at our church (it only had one bell) when the vicar let me. It gave you an immense feeling of power for some strange reason.
I like watching the Morris men. It's a great pity it's not more popular. They occasionally have a troupe of Morris men performing at the Bay Horse in Scholes, or the Green Dragon in Wentworth.
The more they dance, the more they drink and the more wild the dancing gets. Then they bring out the swords and have the paramedics standing by.
It really is a darned good laugh.
When I was in my early teens, I occasionally used to ring the bell at our church (it only had one bell) when the vicar let me. It gave you an immense feeling of power for some strange reason.
I like watching the Morris men. It's a great pity it's not more popular. They occasionally have a troupe of Morris men performing at the Bay Horse in Scholes, or the Green Dragon in Wentworth.
The more they dance, the more they drink and the more wild the dancing gets. Then they bring out the swords and have the paramedics standing by.
It really is a darned good laugh.
A
Andy "the Dog" Nellist (SAA) (ACA)
Guest
John your post was extremely offensive and labelled Ron as something that he certainly is not... you should be ashamed of yourself and you certainly owe Ron a very big apology.
B
BAZ (Angel of the North) aka Fester
Guest
"Knowledge of entomology."
Entomology my ar$e.
Trout will take the fluff from your belly button.
Entomology is akin to some of the daftest Carp rigs that have recently been spoken about. It just isn't needed.
Entomology my ar$e.
Trout will take the fluff from your belly button.
Entomology is akin to some of the daftest Carp rigs that have recently been spoken about. It just isn't needed.
John Wesley
New member
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As a former miner from Worksop (rons old patch) obviously this is not an angling issue, so to here Ron go on about dear old Maggie and have a political view like his is very annoying so no i will not be apologising, and as for extremely offensive and ashamed Andy that should be for Rons tory government of the 1980s.
John,
I was going to write an entire chapter and verse description detailing how wrong your comments are, however, given your last post and your former occupation I realise it would be a complete and utter waste of my time.
Therefore I will simply join with Andy and strongly suggest that you most certainly owe Ron an apology!
I was going to write an entire chapter and verse description detailing how wrong your comments are, however, given your last post and your former occupation I realise it would be a complete and utter waste of my time.
Therefore I will simply join with Andy and strongly suggest that you most certainly owe Ron an apology!
Mark Wintle
Well-known member
Kevin,
re article.
Could it be that running a commercial coarse/carp fishery is more profitable than a day ticket trout water rather than trout anglers' attitudes to methods? A trout water has to restock at a rate that allows for losses yet is sufficiently high to provide good sport on average, and therefore there is a danger that the cost of the trout, bailiffs wages, business rates etc comes perillously close to exceeding the income from ticket sales. With a carp water once the initial stocking cost is taken care of, the income is much more profit, and given the means of squeezing out more income from carp anglers - extra for each rod, extra for each 8 hour period/overnight etc then it will make more economic sense. At least a couple of waters locally have converted to all coarse from trout possibly for this very reason. Pallington is the best known - 3 lakes, one was trout, now all carp/tench, and more recently gone from day ticket/club concession to syndicate at around ?475 per year.
Re writing
Please give up immediately so that I can finally overtake you! Only joking. The strength of FM's writing is that there is a wide range of tyes of artices. That means that there must be plenty of instruction/comment/descriptive that can balance the eclectic/humour/fiction. There are lots of potential writers out there but many think they don't have the ability, and certainly don't have the confidence to have a go, so until some of them pluck up courage FM needs the prolific and confident regulars to continue. So your resignation letter has been filed away...
Mark
re article.
Could it be that running a commercial coarse/carp fishery is more profitable than a day ticket trout water rather than trout anglers' attitudes to methods? A trout water has to restock at a rate that allows for losses yet is sufficiently high to provide good sport on average, and therefore there is a danger that the cost of the trout, bailiffs wages, business rates etc comes perillously close to exceeding the income from ticket sales. With a carp water once the initial stocking cost is taken care of, the income is much more profit, and given the means of squeezing out more income from carp anglers - extra for each rod, extra for each 8 hour period/overnight etc then it will make more economic sense. At least a couple of waters locally have converted to all coarse from trout possibly for this very reason. Pallington is the best known - 3 lakes, one was trout, now all carp/tench, and more recently gone from day ticket/club concession to syndicate at around ?475 per year.
Re writing
Please give up immediately so that I can finally overtake you! Only joking. The strength of FM's writing is that there is a wide range of tyes of artices. That means that there must be plenty of instruction/comment/descriptive that can balance the eclectic/humour/fiction. There are lots of potential writers out there but many think they don't have the ability, and certainly don't have the confidence to have a go, so until some of them pluck up courage FM needs the prolific and confident regulars to continue. So your resignation letter has been filed away...
Mark
GrahamM
Managing Editor
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Kevin, surely you're not going to allow Ron to think he has the power to get rid of contributors that easily?
"My next article is already written," wrote Kevin, "and perhaps prophetically it is about the future of FM, a future which will so obviously be better off without my inane ramblings, so I will make it the last."
Really Kevin, you shouldn't put so much store on Ron's opinion. There are thousands of others who would disagree that we'd be better off without your 'inane ramblings'. I can't believe you're going to allow one man, one message, to put an end to your entertaining writing on FM. There must surely be a deeper reason than that.
Me, I look upon such strong outbursts about my own inane ramblings as an indication that what I wrote was powerful enough to ignite such an outburst. When you write opinion pieces of any kind, satirical or otherwise, you have to expect reaction and often it comes at the most unexpected times.
And when it does, and when it's strong, you think, "great, that's got the old codger wound up, I did a good job there!"
Don't get annoyed, enjoy it, and then get even.
His message was a load of b******* that's for sure, at least in the manner in which he wrote it. Almost as bad as the rant against Ron from John Wesley.
Which has gone right over his head.
"My next article is already written," wrote Kevin, "and perhaps prophetically it is about the future of FM, a future which will so obviously be better off without my inane ramblings, so I will make it the last."
Really Kevin, you shouldn't put so much store on Ron's opinion. There are thousands of others who would disagree that we'd be better off without your 'inane ramblings'. I can't believe you're going to allow one man, one message, to put an end to your entertaining writing on FM. There must surely be a deeper reason than that.
Me, I look upon such strong outbursts about my own inane ramblings as an indication that what I wrote was powerful enough to ignite such an outburst. When you write opinion pieces of any kind, satirical or otherwise, you have to expect reaction and often it comes at the most unexpected times.
And when it does, and when it's strong, you think, "great, that's got the old codger wound up, I did a good job there!"
Don't get annoyed, enjoy it, and then get even.
His message was a load of b******* that's for sure, at least in the manner in which he wrote it. Almost as bad as the rant against Ron from John Wesley.
Which has gone right over his head.
B
BAZ (Angel of the North) aka Fester
Guest
John Wesley/Kevin.
This is a gentlemans forum. stand your ground. No quarter asked for and none given.
Let the festivities begin.
This is a gentlemans forum. stand your ground. No quarter asked for and none given.
Let the festivities begin.
R
Ron 'The Hat' Clay (ACA-Life Member)
Guest
To be honest, if there is one subject that is going to make me bite, it is that of snobbery in fly fishing.
There isn't any such thing! I have fly fished on and off for 40 years I guess and I have never met one single snob in this form of angling. We might take the Pi$$ out of "those beastly coarse fishahs" of course, and we might joke a bit about wearing tweeds etc.
But that's all it is, a bloody good joke and a laugh from time to time.
The vast majority of fly fishers are the most open and friendly bunch you will ever meet. I have lost count of the number of time I have sat with other fly fishers on the bank side comparing fly patterns and notes. Ask a fly fisher on your local reservoir how the fishing is going, and he will tell you. Ask for some advice if he is catching and you are not and he will give it - openly - believe me.
Just try doing that with some carp anglers!!!
And really, I don't mind being wound up at all.
For example, I 'm always winding Ed up about him being a Scouser, and he is always trying to wind me up about me being a supposedly rank stinking Maggie loving Tory.
But off this site, I can assure you we are the best of mates.
There isn't any such thing! I have fly fished on and off for 40 years I guess and I have never met one single snob in this form of angling. We might take the Pi$$ out of "those beastly coarse fishahs" of course, and we might joke a bit about wearing tweeds etc.
But that's all it is, a bloody good joke and a laugh from time to time.
The vast majority of fly fishers are the most open and friendly bunch you will ever meet. I have lost count of the number of time I have sat with other fly fishers on the bank side comparing fly patterns and notes. Ask a fly fisher on your local reservoir how the fishing is going, and he will tell you. Ask for some advice if he is catching and you are not and he will give it - openly - believe me.
Just try doing that with some carp anglers!!!
And really, I don't mind being wound up at all.
For example, I 'm always winding Ed up about him being a Scouser, and he is always trying to wind me up about me being a supposedly rank stinking Maggie loving Tory.
But off this site, I can assure you we are the best of mates.