RICHARD WALKER AVON MK IV

[Ron 'The Hat' Clay (ACA-Life Member)]

When rods in hollow glass started to appear in the early 60s, many anglers were not impressed by them and still preferred split cane. Bill Keal, a famous specimen hunter of the time, wrote an article in the magazine: "Fishing" stating that hollow glass rods lacked the steeliness of cane and did not drive the hook in so well.

**** Walker was not impressed at all and it was only when Hardys blank manufacturer - Fibretube, started to develop phenolic resin glass rods that Walker did finally sit up and take note.

At that time, my old Friend Tag Barnes designed a range of glass fibre rods for Sportex, who's blanks were made in Germany. Tag sent **** an example of one of the rods. **** thought it wasn't bad but still preferred split cane saying that it wouldn't be a good idea to make a violin out of glass. Tag answered Walker by saying someone should try making a violin out of glass - it might sound better!

Nevertheless, Walker helped design a whole range of rods for Hardys using the new phenolic blanks. Phenolic resins gave glass a much better modulus of elasticity.

By the way, if anyone has any old phenolic blanks around and want to cut them or play about with them - don't! Phenolic resin particles and fumes are extremely carcinogenic

 

[Bob Watson]

Ron, I think you'll find that the spine or preferred plane of bending is normally used as a guide for whipping eyes on, either above for a stiffer action or below for a slower action, if the eyes are whipped on according to the spine, one way or the other it shouldn't really effect casting accuracy any more than human error, wind direction or the direction of the nearest ducks last fart. More recently on poles, where the sections are numbered and arrowed, holding the pole with the numbers/arrows either up or down gives a stiffer/saggier pole depending on the relative position of the arrows to the spine.

I was pretty close to the top of my physics class at school, honestly I was, but my head hurts!! too much theory, which is based on ideal conditions and not enough practise which is based on, well, practise, don't talk about em' fish with em'!

 

[Morespiders]

Its old, throw the bloody thing away, or use it in the garden.Cane rods were never any good anyway!.

 

[Morespiders]

four and half a year old thread,just realised,what did the beans taste like, were they nice?

 

[Ron 'The Hat' Clay (ACA-Life Member)]

I agree Bob. However it is nice at times to investigate the theory bit. I provides some sort of datum point for understanding what happens in practice.

For example one of the biggest loads of tosh still bandied around today is the theory of the test curve. A true test curve is impossible to attain in practice.

 

[Sean Meeghan]

Hi Folks

Had to go to the pub to recover! Looks like More Spiders was still at the pub!

Fred, thanks for your explanation. I agree that a solid structure will ultimately break down less easily than a hollow structure (what price Buckminster Fullerine?!!!!). You've got me on to the qualitative stuff myself now - probably a class 2 drug!

Ron, I understand the the structure of bamboo. As a natural engineering material it has some almost miraculous properties.

By my tenth pint I'd given up trying to persuade an angel to sit on the pin I'd brought with me (or rather her boyfriend had!) but I did come up with the concept of Clay's Modulus of Steeliness. Trips off the tongue better than Young's Modulus or the second moment of area doesn't it!

I get up this morning and you've got on to casting and striking. Aaargh! I've only one thing to say to you: conservation of momentum and the impulse momentum equation - going back to the pub in a bit!!!

 

[Sean Meeghan]

And you're not going to provoke me on test curves Ron!

Come to think of it Clay's Modulus of Steeliness might be the solution to that little conundrum.

 

[Ron 'The Hat' Clay (ACA-Life Member)]

By the way if anyone has the notion that people like myself who discuss the properties of split bamboo are living in the past, think again.

The properties of split bamboo rods are worthy of greater study in the light of the many materials which are available to us these days. And who knows, the understanding of such properties, might provide a stepping stone to the future.

Personally I feel we have almost reached the ultimate in terms of hollow tube fishing rod construction. Further developments just may take place along the path of anisotropic or asymmetrical fibrous structures, replicating the marvellous properties of cane but using much lighter and stronger materials.

 

[Ron 'The Hat' Clay (ACA-Life Member)]

On the subject of test curves I would suggest to anyone who wants further clarification on this subject to read the article written by Dr Stephen Harrison in the Harrison Advanced Rods website. A link is provided on this website.

You do not get anyone more qualified to write about this subject than Dr Steve. He is boss of a firm that manufactures in my opinion some of the finest carbon fishing rod blanks in the world.

And here lies a strange paradox.

Harrisons are based in Liverpool??..... )

 

[Sean Meeghan]

Careful Ron I was educated in Liverpool!

Got a nice set of hub caps if you're interested though.....

 

[Ron 'The Hat' Clay (ACA-Life Member)]

You should get together with Ed Sean and compare notes.

 

[Sean Meeghan]

He probably won't talk to me cos I'm a woolly back!

 

[ED (The ORIGINAL and REAL one)]

I bet you had a good time there too, Sean ??

 

[Mark Wintle]

Ron,

Whilst the subject of test curves is tricky, and Steve Harrison has a fair point in that you cannot measure/compare them easiliy, they do provide one reference point for comparison. I have a Harrison Interceptor 1-10 test curve (nominal) that is superb but when I used it it was much more forgiving than I expected, and when I read Chris Turnbull stating that he thought it had a test curve of circa 1-05 I measured it myself and got a similar figure. If I am able to measure test curves with a minimum of not very scientific equipment to at least get some idea it can't be that hard.

For reference, I believe that a test curve should always be measured by using a line threaded through the rings and pulling on that rather than pulling on the tip itself. With the rod horizontal I get the tip to vertical. I load a bucket with weights, and weigh that when I have achieved the approximate loading.

The real question is whether the method used could be significantly improved so that comparison could be made. Certainly, in comparing some barbel rods last year all with supposed 1.75lb test curves I found it hard to correlate the two that I compared (Wytchwood and Shimano) as they appeared to have very different actions. But in this day and age we surely ought to be able to concoct a standard test?

Good to see that ovality wasn't an issue ;o)

 

[Bob Watson]

I must agree with Ron about test curves. They serve no purpose at all, I can't think of any occasion, when using a rod in practise that we'll actually hold it parallel to the ground and note when it "hits" a 90? bend. If you want to know what a rod is capable of, fish with it! I've got two very cheap but very functional "Carp" rods of a stated 2 1/2lb test curve, I actually bought them with Zander and Barbel in mind, they are more forgiving in the tip than my 1 1/4 lb Avon rod, if I was asked to put a "TC" on them I'd have said, in comparison to my Avon, considerably less than 2 1/2 lb. Go figure!! I think it all comes down to casting properties, there's no way I could cast (not lob) a 4oz lead and 6oz deadbait on said rods but I could certainly land anything I'd be likely to hook on them. That's probably why they've been labelled "Carp" they could easily cast a 2oz lead and a boilie. I think people are getting hung up on the whole concept of test curves!

 

[Ron 'The Hat' Clay (ACA-Life Member)]

Let me try to explain where test curves go out of the window. And here I am talking about casting performance, not fish playing capablities

Very simply compare a rod with a fast taper with a theoretical test curve of 2 lbs to one with a slow taper with the same test curve.

The fast taper rod will assume it's test curve when only a small part of the top section is significantly deflected. The slow taper when virtually all the rod is deflected. Yet the fast taper rod will be cabable of casting a heavier weight a lot further than the slow taper.

However I know what rod I would prefer for putting really heavy pressure onto a big fish. It would not be the fast taper.

Getting the combination of distance casting and fish playing properties takes a lot of doing and is part of the skill of a good rod designer.

Harrison Ballista carp rods and Chimera Barbel rods are supreme examples of the modern rod makers art in my opinion.

I do however tend to smile somewhat when I read that a rod has a test curve of 1 lb 10 oz.

And you are right Mark, a rods TC loading should be judged by loading it with the line.

 

[Bob Watson]

I'm pleased you rate the chimera Ron. I've just bought two custom mades.

1lb 12oz test curve, Ahem!! I'll get my my coat;-)

 

[Ron 'The Hat' Clay (ACA-Life Member)]

Bob,

My Harrison Chemiras will chuck a 4 oz lead right across the tidal Trent at Collingham. They will also give you a lot of fun with medium sized barbel. I have caught quite a number of double figure barbel on them as well as double figure pike. They inspire supreme confidence when playing a big fish.

If you study the blank very carefully, it actually has a compound taper and uses a different pre-preg carbon for the top 25% of it's length.

I think Dr. Steve was responsible for a very clever bit of rod design here.

And Tony, you should try a Chemira. It might change your mind about carbon and barbel rods in general.

 

[Bob Watson]

Ron,

I've been going to buy one or two of these rods for a few years now, I'm pleased with myself for taking my time. I already own 3 rods based on Harrison blanks, they're all built by one man, No name dropping publicly, but he's well known and very good.

You are, as always, correct! They will cast a 4oz lead, but they will also detect a shy bite from a Swale Chub

 

[Tony Rocca]

Ron,
I tried Peregrine GTI, Peregrine SU Avon, and Peregrine GTX. All custom built on Harrison blanks and considered by many to be the finest in the land. I caught barbel on them all.

I did quite like the GTX to be honest, once I got the hang of the feel, a fine rod.

Its just not the same as cane though, must just be me, I always was a bit strange )